Interview: Zu
The most important is always the present, and that what we do stays fresh and alive and relevant to us.
Italian instrumentalists Zu recently teamed up with Tatsuya Yoshida aka Ruins and the resulting collaboration has recently been released as Jazzisdead Live, an album that is as vibrant and eclectic as you would imagine. To celebrate this album, Gavin Brown caught up with Massimo Pupillo, the bassist of Zu, to hear all about the collaboration and how it came about as well as hearing what Zu are up to next.
E&D: Jazzisdead Live, your new collaborative album with Ruins/ Ruins Alone as RuinsZu is out now. What has the initial reaction to it like been?
Massimo: We are overwhelmed by the reaction, the album almost sold out in little more than a week, so we can’t be happier really.
E&D: Have you been wanting to work with Tatsuya Yoshida for a while now and how did this collaboration come about?
Massimo: Yoshida–san wrote to me out of nowhere after a few years of silence, asking if I was up to play 2 or 3 shows with him, which I immediately agreed upon . We played a few duo improv shows and they went so well that we thought we could make it again but with Luca and playing both bands’ material. Yoshida chose the Zu material he wanted to play and we chose our favourite Ruins tracks, to make it more exciting.
E&D: How was the experience of the festival where the Jazzisdead Live album was recorded?
Massimo: Excellent, it was the final show of twenty three in a row and we were so tight at that point: It was a really nice coincidence to have the recording equipment at the festival, we had not thought about it at all, and we heard only after a few days that our show was actually recorded on multitrack!
E&D: What are your favourite ever live albums?
Massimo: Pink Floyd at Pompeii, the Coil live series. Robert Fripp’s Frippertronics recordings, Ricochet by Tangerine Dream, Japan’s Oil On Canvas, Nomeansno Live and Cuddly.
E&D: How did you first discover the music of Ruins in the first place?
Massimo: In the 90’s as we were starting Zu we were huge fans of the Japanese noise scene. Ruins’ Hyderomastgroningem album made quite an impact on our idea of other possibilities in music back then. There was everything we liked in it, mixed so tightly together, and played by only a duo. We later discovered that many other great bands were Ruins fans too.
E&D: What are your favourite pieces of music by Tatsuya Yoshida?
Massimo: Probably the ones we played together! And a few more of course too. But I have to add that by studying and playing his music our appreciation grew bigger, thinking “how can anyone come up with these ideas” ?
E&D: How did your recent European tour go and what were some of the highlights of the run?
Massimo: It went very well, above our expectations really. Not having toured for a few years and not having released any new album, we’re certainly not the band in the album-tour- next album category. But we were welcomed as if there was a new release out, and even our bookers were happily surprised at how much interest Zu is gathering. It’s a nice feeling, a nice feedback to have.
E&D: As it has been your first Euro tour in six years, how much has touring changed for you in that time especially post COVID?
Massimo: There has been quite big changes in life since 2020, hasn’t there? We kept quiet for a while as we needed to study the situation thoroughly , also in terms of our possible output of things to say and inspiration, and also waiting for a clear “GO” sign from the universe, which happened to be Yoshida’s call I have to say. On one side everything is surely more difficult, but at the same time we feel more than ever that there is a very human, allow me to say a spiritual need for a connection and communion, that in this secular world hasn’t many chances to happen, and it happens sometimes at some shows, almost like a gift. We witnessed this as an audience in the first place, growing up and going to see bands like Fugazi for example, and thank God we witnessed this sense of communion with the audience as a band too. Like entering something bigger than us, bigger than the sum of the individuals gathered in one place. There is a human and spiritual need for something that can happen only in live conditions, not on a screen, not on streaming, not through AI. Not yet at least and hopefully for a while! And for some more time, we really feel that we need to carry on that torch, that we humbly picked up from other bands.
E&D: Did you perform any music from Jazzisdead Live?
Massimo: No, we like to keep changing and challenging ourselves. Also with Zu we deliver a different set of ideas. We found out that our album Cortar Todo represents a lot of what we wanted to express in this moment in history, and you can have a sense of it from the song titles. So most of the recent live set is based on that album, which is also a way for us to tribute the great late Gabe Serbian, who is always in our hearts.
E&D: Have you got plans for any other lives dates to perform the album for the rest of the year?
Massimo: Not as RuinsZu, but as Zu yes, we have a little bit of a nice schedule in front of us.
E&D: Do you have good memories of playing live with Ruins in the 1990s?
Massimo: Of course, it was wild, we were just starting and playing with one of our favourite bands, which luckily happened a lot in our history. It made us feel like anything was possible. And back then it probably was. There were loads of incredible bands, there were small venues and squats everywhere, and we just went for it, without a plan B, learning along the way, making mistakes, and never losing enthusiasm really.
E&D: I first saw Zu live at the Supersonic festival in 2017 and it was mindblowing! Do you have good memories of playing the festival and are you looking forward to playing again at this years event?
Massimo: We love, absolutely love Supersonic! It’s one of those festivals where we stay and watch other bands, we love their programs, I remember seeing Zonal, Melt Banana, and many more exciting acts. Plus my bass guitars are from Birmingham and it feels always special to me to bring them where they were born.
E&D: What have been some of the greatest live shows that Zu have played to date?
Massimo: It’s hard to say, I probably because we don’t think this way, the most important is always the present, and that what we do stays fresh and alive, and relevant to us, and that we are in the enthusiasm zone. It probably sound like a platitude but we really roll this way and try to stay as much as possible in the present moment.
E&D: Are there plans for a new Zu studio album?
Massimo: Yes there are! But I guess it would be too early to talk about it.
E&D: Are you working on any other music at the moment that you can tell us about?
Massimo: Yes we always tend to do other things too, but at this point Zu, as the mothership, has all the priority.
E&D: What have been some of the other highlights from your time with Zu so far?
Massimo: Everything, it’s very hard to separate it from life because it’s a story of friends, most from the same neighbourhood, doing this thing together, not only the band members but crew as well, it’s indivisible.
E&D: You have worked with the likes of Mike Patton, Buzz Osborne, Eugene Robinson, Steve Mackay and Nobukazu Takemura on the music of Zu. What are your memories of collaborating with these artists?
Massimo: Yes, and a few more, Damo Suzuki for example. David Tibet of Current 93, or Joe Lally of Fugazi… it’s always been about the people, it always started with meeting someone. Sometimes, more often than not, developing friendships, so music has always been the output of a biggest story of connections and living conversation, sometimes translating out there in new ideas. We have been very lucky, all we had to do was keep open and feed an adventurous spirit, everything else just came to us really.
E&D: You also collaborated with Dälek on a split realise. How was that experience and would you like to work with more hip hop artists in the future?
Massimo: Again in this case, Dälek were friends and also tour an label buddies for a while, we’re still in touch and we very much love what they do, but maybe we consider them more an industrial band. Personally hip hop is not my thing, not after Public Enemy at least. I know Dälek are hip hop too, but they are open to strangeness and experimentation and so their appeal to me comes from this different angle.
E&D: Who are your biggest influences as musicians?
Massimo: There are so many, countless ones. Many, probably for us even a majority, are extra-musical. And they would fill a book or two: Pasolini, Philip K Dick. Lots of mystic literature, The Gnostic Texts. Aurobindo. Soo, let’s stick to music. Because there are so many there too. Our thing, I think, has always been having a vast territory of influences and musical interests that spans from renaissance music to industrial, from ambient to metal, from contemporary classical to post-punk. Collectively but also each one of us has this broad territory, with different tastes but also of course many strong points we share in common. Inspiration comes from this sense of mystery surrounding other people ‘s work, people who found a unique voice. For example, I can tell you that one of my favourite musicians, as far as bass players, is Mick Karn of Japan and Dali’s Car. And I have absolutely nothing in common with him nor I would ever even try. But his uniqueness and vision, that’s what influences me. So, it’s not like you admire someone and you try to emulate them, it’s more in terms of genuine human and artistic inspiration.
